Best type of flour for New York neighborhood style pizza?

All trumps? KASL? Whaddya think?

I like to use a very high protein flour for this type of pizza. My vote goes for All Trumps.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Jah I wanted to add one thing since I ran into this with finding the right All-Trumps flour to work with. Tom recommended product #50143 and it worked out great when I played around with it. Best of luck!

Having sold food b4…many of my bread bakers & pizza guys preferred All Trumps and hated it when broached $9/bag…lol

I also moved quite a bit of Kyrol & I tried it last fall…was quite nice…

The A.T. flour runs about 14% protein content and the Kyrol comes in at about 13.2%, both are very good quality flours, and I think the difference in performance between the two is moot, to be honest with you, years ago we did a study on different flour protein contents, and we found that there rteally wasn’t all that much difference between flours with protein contents ranging from a low of 12.2% to a high of 14.2%. When you dipped to something in the 11% range there was a much more significant difference in performance, but then too, there was a change in wheat type too, from spring wheat for the higher protein content flours to winter wheat for the lower protein content flours.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Thanks for the responses. What does everybody think is the optimal fermentation time with this type of flour/dough? I know some Neopolitan and Neo-Neopolitan pizzerias let their dough ferment for up to 3 days. Would that still work well with this type of flour?

With the 13 to 14% protein flours you can go as long as 3-days in the cooler without much of a problem, just make sure you are on top of your game when it comes to hitting the targeted finished dough temperature. With the lower, 12% protein content range flours, we find that the maximum fermentation time in the cooler is about 2-days. You should be targeting a finished dough temperature of 75 to 80F for what you want to do.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor


Are you sure about the protein content of the Kyrol high-gluten flour? I thought the range was 13.8-14.2%.


You’re right, I stand corrected, the protein content of ConAgra’a Kyrol flour averages at 14%, about the same as General Mills all Trumps.
Thanks for catching that.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Thanks again for the info. Another question, is using a starter an effective way to make the taste better/more complex with this type of pizza?

All trumps is bleached and bromated. Since we had a post that looked like a it was gonna be a sales pitch, I started thinking about it.

Making pizza with unbleached (really naturally bleached) un bromated flour is definately a marketing angle. But, in your opinion, does it matter if the flour is B and B?

What are the positives and negatives.

Thanks for your time.

The flour that I mentioned is All-Trumps #50143 is the one Tom got me using and it is unbleached and not Pot-Brom’d!

Thanks mike

It doesn’t make a lot of difference if the flour is bromated or not from a dough performance stand point, it “might” exhibit a little more memory with the bromate, but if you are looking for 3 or more days of refrigerated storage life, the bromated version will have a slight edge on performance. Customer perception of bromate is typically not good to “what is bromate?”, unless you are in California where it use is highly frowned upon, and your pizza would need to come with a warning like that on a pack of cigarettes, or in Canada where it is illegal. As for the bleaching, it only makes the flour whiter in color, no one really seems concerned over bleaching, and if has no impact upon how the dough performs. The All Trumps that Mike had mentioned (50143) is a not bromated version for those who don’t want the bromate.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Thank you Tom, for the explanation, its appreciated.

Whats your opinion on using Conagra’s seal of Minnesota for:
NY style
NH style


It is a little on the low side protein content wise for an authentic dine in N.Y. but if you’re into any delivery, it will probably work better than something like All Trumps as the pizza won’t be quite as tough and chewy after a half hout or more in a box. Otherwise, it will work just fine so long as you keep the referated life to not more than 2-days.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

3 days does seem to be the limit for our dough. We try and use at three days. We do about 30% takeout. Yeah, the all trumps is a BIT tough for the morning counter slice, but to me, its far superior for a fresh out of the oven NY AND NH style pie. Currently that is the flour of choice for Pepe’s in NH (though they change EVERYTHING throughout the years)

Thanks for the input. I appreciate it.

Im actually transitioning over to the All Trumps flour, I hope it performs for me as well as my past flour, Im getting it in tomorrow and am going to try it out this week.