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How many cloves

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daisy

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I am going to infuse some E.V.O.O. with cloves of garlic, how many cloves would you suggest in a liter of oil ?? Is it just trial & error, I like garlic, BUT do not want it overwhelming, also thought of roasting first
 
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Your local health inspector most likely have you file for a variance, and require that you construct a formal HACCP plan, so be ready for that.
Why? Because you are dealing with products well know for propagating C. Botulinum. And C Bot. doesn’t get you a little bit sick, it kills you. I believe it may even be the deadliest toxin known.

Constructing a HACCP plan from scratch for potentially hazardous products is no fun at all. I am in the process right now because we cure our own meats at our place.

Here is a page with Meat HACCP plan templates, they are 10 years old, so expect conversion issues cuz these were done on a W-95 OS http://www.meathaccp.wisc.edu/
I do not know of any resources for “Preservation of garlic in Oil” HACCP plan templates.
 
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there are a LOT of companies pressing garlic olive oil these days . . . I applaud the committment to house made products, so if you plan to kkep it more than a day or two, then get a commercially manufactured flavored oil. You can do it right . . . but is even minimal botulism risk worth a little money? If it is, then do it with meticulous technique and well documented procedures.
 
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Daisy;
You are getting great advice here, please don’t make it yourself, the risk is just too great, and the bottled stuff is way too cheap. If you just gotta do your own thing though, make it for the day only and DISCARD at the end of the day. No matter how good you are at taking the nexcessary precautions, remember that if anytrhing does go wrong, sympathy cards will be in order. The most infamous words ever said or printed are: Don’t Worry; Nothing Can Go Wrong, go wrong, go, wrong, go wrong, go wrong.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor
 
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Tom is right on (as usual). One other thing to consider is that the fresh garlic you buy is not the same from day to day. Chinese garlic does not have the same flavor profile as Cali garlic, and even garlic from the same place has a change in the flavor profile from month to month.

Your customers expect consistency from you. That is impossible with fresh garlic. Yes, it is similar, but when you need to cook it, that adds another variable that will change the flavor profile. An inconsistent product is a good way to lose a customer.

So you have done some ‘research’ on the internet and found a guy who uses fresh garlic and happens to have not made Clostridium botulinum. Putting something like, “We use fresh garlic in our olive oil infusion!” is not a selling point to anyone who has a modicum of food safety training. We all know that is something you do not do. It is a negative sales point to an educated customer, and in this day and age, education is free to anyone with a smart phone.

Go to Costco and buy yourself Johnny’s Garlic Spread & Seasoning. Use that. Your flavor will be consistent, and you will have no problems with botulism.
 
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Kinda reminds me of the defense for playing Russian Roulette. When questioned about how dangerous it was the individual simply responded “I don’t see how it can be all that dangerous, everyone I’ve questioned about it said that they came away a winner and the game was perfectly safe.” This is not the logic we should embrace.
Instead, use “Better to be safe than sorry.”
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor
 
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Enough said…Will do, thanks for the advice, after reading the first few comments, I went out already found a great infused oil at a local supply store… 🙂
 
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Trying not to hijack the thread here, but are there any concerns with adding fresh garlic to a canned tomato product and holding them together refrigerated for up to 7 days? This will not be cooked, just mixed together and held until used on a pizza. I know the concern with oil is that its holding the oil in an oxygen free environment, but wouldn’t the tomato be mostly oxygen free? Or does the acidity of the tomato prevent botulism?

Thanks

-Dan
 
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Dan;
There was a report of clostridium from (I believe Indiana) a few years ago. It seemed that a young house wife canned some tomato sauce containing onion and garlic. Several months later when the sauce was used several members of the family died due to botulism poisioning. The problem was traced to the fact that low acid, yellow tomatoes were used instead of the typical high acid red tomatoes called for in the canning recipe. Needless to say the acidity was not adjusted for the low acid tomatoes. So to answer your question, yes, clostridium will grow in a tomato based sauce and yes the acidity will inhibit the growth of clostridium BUT you need to be sure the sauce is sufficiently acid to do so. You will need to CONFIRM THIS, but if I remember correctly, the pH needs to be down around 4.5. This can be accomplished through the addition of acetic or citric acid. CONFIRM,CONFIRM, CONFIRM.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor
 
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durbancic:
Trying not to hijack the thread here, but are there any concerns with adding fresh garlic to a canned tomato product and holding them together refrigerated for up to 7 days? This will not be cooked, just mixed together and held until used on a pizza. I know the concern with oil is that its holding the oil in an oxygen free environment, but wouldn’t the tomato be mostly oxygen free? Or does the acidity of the tomato prevent botulism?

Thanks

-Dan
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Mr. Lehmann shared a story about home-canned tomato product that was low-acid, and in an “Low-Oxgen/Oxygen-free” environment, which is exactly what is needed for C. Botulinum to propagate.
Oil is another oxygen-free environment and that is why there is so much danger involved with it.

A tomato sauce mixture that is not pressure canned or held under a vacuum after mixing should be just fine, you have the acidity, and you have oxygen, and as long as you date it and it is all used or discarded after 7 days, I personally do not see any problems
Someone please correct me if I am wrong.
 
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GR;
You are absolutely correct. If you were to just mix the sauce and refrigerate you would not have a problem. Depending upon shop conditions, you might begin to see some mold forming at about a week, and if you have onion or garlic in the sauce you will see it thicken substancially due to the catalyzing effect upon the pectin in the tomato as a result of the onion/garlic. If you don’t want this effect, we just microwave the onion/garlic in some water, bringing it up to a boil and then adding it to the sauce and stirring in. DO NOT store the sauce in an aluminum container. Stainless steel pots or 5-gallon lidded buckets work well.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor
 
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So if I follow this procedure I should not have any problems, correct?
-Drain 74/40 tomato
-Add garlic & basil & salt to food processor
-Add tomato

Place processed sauce into 1/3 cambro and date and store for no longer than 6-7 days.

Dan
 
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durbancic:
So if I follow this procedure I should not have any problems, correct?
-Drain 74/40 tomato
-Add garlic & basil & salt to food processor
-Add tomato

Place processed sauce into 1/3 cambro and date and store for no longer than 6-7 days.

Dan
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I am in full agreement with Mr. Lehmann.
And I learned even more from him, because I was not aware of the pectin causing a thickening effect with the onions and garlic. Thanks for sharing that Mr. Lehmann

To lessen the chances of early mold growth, make sure that all your utensils and containers are properly sanitized, avoid all bare hand contact with your food prep surfaces, and the interior container surfaces along with your food products and it will dramatically decrease the chances of mold growth.

You are still limited to 7 days refrigerated storage as per proper food handling rules.

And maybe if you are not using all of the sauce within the allotted hold time, maybe you could cut the batch size down and make it more often?

I am not a pizza guru like most of the people here, I am actually in the middle of relearning everything about pizza that I can.
I do have a few decades in the foodservice industry and I am now adding pizza to our menu,
Hence why I read and comment on these forums.
I might be able to help anyone learn things about BBQ or charcuterie if you’re interested, so please feel free to PM me, maybe I can help…
 
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Dan;
That should work. Just be sure to check it daily for any signs of bubbling which would indicate yeast or bacteria contamination.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor
 
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