Lawsuit Against Domino's for Failing to Reimburse Drivers

[Charles]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
gregster:

You are CLEARLY ignoring the fact that the DOL puts the burden of proof of adequate pay on the employer.

Again, show me some case or law where the government has stated that you MUST pay the IRS standard mileage deduction. If the employee and the employer AGREE that the amount the employer pays covers the employees ACTUAL expenses, then there is no issue.

 

[Wizzle_Wassell]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
gregster:

You are CLEARLY ignoring the fact that the DOL puts the burden of proof of adequate pay on the employer.

Yes, but this isn’t a pay issue its an expense reimbursement issue otherwise the section or the section that dealt with mileage would have included this WHICH NEITHER DOES!

You MAY be right, you MAY be wrong but you’re definately picking words out of definate areas to suit your purpose. If IT WERE CLEAR then there would be no argument would there. And seeing as how you are in position to TELL us, or MAKE the decision then as said previously lets let the professionals who interpret, enforce and make the law tell us. Does the phrase monkey and organ grider mean anything?

 

[dman66]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
gregster:

Nichols Kaster, PLLP Brings Lawsuit Against Domino’s Pizza for Failing to Reimburse Drivers for Travel Expenses
MINNEAPOLIS, MN–(Marketwire - March 6, 2009) - On March 4, 2009, two former employees of Domino’s Pizza, LLC filed a class action lawsuit in the Federal District Court for the District of Minnesota. The lawsuit alleges that Domino’s violated state and federal law by failing to reimburse employees for expenses they incurred while delivering pizzas. Under Minnesota law, employers have to reimburse employees for their travel expenses. According to the lawsuit, Domino’s failed to adequately reimburse its drivers, instead paying a ‘per delivery’ amount which was not sufficient to cover drivers’ actual costs.

The lawsuit also involves minimum wage claims. Under both Minnesota law and the federal Fair Labor Standards Act, all employees are entitled to be paid the minimum wage “free and clear” of obligations to their employer. The lawsuit alleges that by requiring pizza delivery drivers to pay for their own automobile expenses, Domino’s also failed to pay their drivers the minimum wage.

Plaintiff’s attorney E. Michelle Drake explained, “The lawsuit alleges that Domino’s required employees to subsidize their business by paying for their own automobile and gas expenses. Minnesota law forbids employers from requiring employees to pay these kinds of expenses. What makes this situation even more egregious is that many Domino’s drivers were only supposed to be paid the minimum wage in the first place. In reality, Domino’s drivers were paid even less than the minimum wage because they had to pay travel expenses out of their own pockets.” Drake continued, "One of the reasons the law exists is to prevent companies like Domino’s from using employees’ money to subsidize their cost of doing business. We hope to recover the money that rightfully belongs to the employees."

Plaintiffs are represented by E. Michelle Drake and Paul J. Lukas from the law firm of Nichols Kaster, PLLP. Nichols Kaster has offices in Minneapolis, Minnesota and San Francisco, California.

Individuals may find information about joining this action at www.nka.com or by calling (612) 256-3200.

How big will this snowball get?

Holy Bee Jezus Christ!! :shock: …Gregster strikes again!..Its not enough a whole new section here had to be started on account of his redundancy…Months later, he is still at it!..

You’d think there was some major monetary, class action law suit amount won here… How big will this Snowball get?..No snow balls here, So far 70 degree weather & sunny skies…

The bottomline is this…As much as I dislike Dominos myself, as much as their pizza sucks…All this effort put in here & 20 years from now Dominos Pizzas will probably still be in business & (on an inflation adjusted basis) the drivers will be making the same money give or take a few bucks an hour…The company will be targeting the same demographics & still making money at it…Any instore postion will have the same responsibilities it does today, same job description as today, & command the same (on an inflation adjusted basis) pay it does today…Not to mention what they won’t give up on either…That’s employing the same low caliber employees they do today…

As for the lawsuit?..I doubt it would be anything substantial on a per driver basis…After all whom is the burden of proof on?..

 

[system]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
Wizzle Wassell:

gregster:

You are CLEARLY ignoring the fact that the DOL puts the burden of proof of adequate pay on the employer.

Yes, but this isn’t a pay issue its an expense reimbursement issue otherwise the section or the section that dealt with mileage would have included this WHICH NEITHER DOES!

Failure to pay adequate mileage that reduces drivers PAY below minimum wage IS a PAY issue! THAT is why the burden of proof is on the employer.

 

[system]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

Charles:

gregster:

Charles:

gregster, would the following scenarios satisfy your interpretation of the laws:

Driver uses his own car.
Driver receives IRS standard mileage deduction of 55 cents per mile
Driver receives $2.13 per hour plus tips.

Driver uses company car
Driver only receives $2.13 per hour plus tips.

Only if tips were enough to make up the difference to minimum wage. At many big 3 stores, including mine, that pay scheme would very often fall short.

Even though it would be legal, you would be hard pressed to find competent and reliable employees at that pay.

:lol: I bet I could! And I bet they would not be whining about it either. At 5-6 miles round trip average, they are getting $2.50 to $3.00 per delivery, plus tips, plus $2.13. Sounds like they would still make about $15-20 an hour.

You seem to think that being a delivery driver is some sort of specialized skill. It isn’t. I traded delivery for working in the store last night so an in store person could try delivery. I gave him my GPS and flashlight. We got slammed. He had NO problems, raked in over $15 an hour not counting his hourly wage, and had a blast. Lots more fun than earning minimum in the store.

You just think too highly about delivering. It ain’t rocket science and it is compensated VERY well.

You continue to confuse reimbursement for use of the drivers vehicle with wages. That’s OK. Many owners and managers have the same mindset. It is because that mindset continues to be perpetuated that I continue to post the facts here.

You just think to lowly about minimum wage laws and mileage reimbursement. For the record, being a manager or an owner is not ‘rocket science’ either. But if it makes you feel better, you can keep believing that it is:

:roll:

 

[system]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

Charles:

gregster:

You are CLEARLY ignoring the fact that the DOL puts the burden of proof of adequate pay on the employer.

Again, show me some case or law where the government has stated that you MUST pay the IRS standard mileage deduction. If the employee and the employer AGREE that the amount the employer pays covers the employees ACTUAL expenses, then there is no issue.

I have repeatedly shown you the law, yet you refuse or fail to understand what it says. I can’t help you with comprehension issues.

Is it that whole “in lieu of” thing that is throwing you off? Click here

’ (IRS) standard business mileage may be used (in place of)actual costs and associated recordkeeping’

 

[Charles]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
gregster:

Wizzle Wassell:

gregster:

You are CLEARLY ignoring the fact that the DOL puts the burden of proof of adequate pay on the employer.

Yes, but this isn’t a pay issue its an expense reimbursement issue otherwise the section or the section that dealt with mileage would have included this WHICH NEITHER DOES!

Failure to pay adequate mileage that reduces drivers PAY below minimum wage IS a PAY issue! THAT is why the burden of proof is on the employer.

You just won’t listen to contradicting evidence, will you, gregster? “Adequate mileage” is NOT the IRS standard mileage deduction. It MAY be, but it does not HAVE to be.

 

[Charles]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
gregster:

Charles:

gregster:

You are CLEARLY ignoring the fact that the DOL puts the burden of proof of adequate pay on the employer.

Again, show me some case or law where the government has stated that you MUST pay the IRS standard mileage deduction. If the employee and the employer AGREE that the amount the employer pays covers the employees ACTUAL expenses, then there is no issue.

I have repeatedly shown you the law, yet you refuse or fail to understand what it says. I can’t help you with comprehension issues.
Is it that whole “in lieu of” thing that is throwing you off? Click here
’ (IRS) standard business mileage may be used (in place of)actual costs and associated recordkeeping’

You must now realize that your argument has some serious flaws in logic since you are resorting to the personal attacks you have so deplored in previous posts. :lol:

 

[Charles]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

You are really getting flustered, gregster! You even changed your signature on TTPG to link to this thread. :lol:

And in your “siggy” thread you even quote on of TTPG rules:

g. Attacking the poster instead of the content of the post. Debate is fine but let’s not get ugly. This typically means you are defeated and have nothing real to say.
:lol:

You really have no life outside of this single issue, do you?

 

[dman66]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

One thing for sure is when gregster gets flustered…Just like a few others on TTPG…Their homosexual fixations act up…Go see the spectacle at TTPG for yourselves… :lol: …

 

[system]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

Charles:

You must now realize that your argument has some serious flaws in logic since you are resorting to the personal attacks you have so deplored in previous posts. :lol:

I only reply ‘in kind’, so don’t act so surprised. Besides, wasn’t it you Charles who so badly wanted me to stop posting on the think tank, yet you follow me fervently here?

MY argument has no flaws at all. You just don’t agree with what the DOL says. That is plain enough to see.

Thanks for keeping the topics at the top of the forum for me. Your posts have been useful. Especially at showing how owners and managers truly feel about drivers and pay issues!

 

[dman66]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

Who in the world does grego think he’s fooling??..

This guy is thee biggest pizza company owner/operator HATER PMQ has ever seen…Maybe even TTPG has ever seen…And being TTPG is a very pro driver website…It says alot about him…

 

[system]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

Charles:

You are really getting flustered, gregster! You even changed your signature on TTPG to link to this thread. :lol:

And in your “siggy” thread you even quote on of TTPG rules:

g. Attacking the poster instead of the content of the post. Debate is fine but let’s not get ugly. This typically means you are defeated and have nothing real to say.
:lol:

You really have no life outside of this single issue, do you?

You accuse me of something when you too are an accomplice in the act? Do you often throw hand grenades straight up in the air and wait for them to fall? :?

At least I got you reading a discussion board where drivers are respected. It’s addictive, isn’t it?

Bottom line is I am spreading the word about minimum wage and mileage reimbursement laws, and you are a big help in that. Your incessant denial of what the law says so clearly only reinforces the stereotype of penny pinching owners doing and saying anything to keep from paying full minimum wage and mileage while crying poverty all the way to the bank.

This really should be a non issue, but to save even a penny it is denounced fiercely here. Your continued posts in denial only reinforce my point. Thanks again.

 

[system]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
gregster:

Charles:

gregster:

Charles:

gregster, would the following scenarios satisfy your interpretation of the laws:

Driver uses his own car.
Driver receives IRS standard mileage deduction of 55 cents per mile
Driver receives $2.13 per hour plus tips.

Driver uses company car
Driver only receives $2.13 per hour plus tips.

Only if tips were enough to make up the difference to minimum wage. At many big 3 stores, including mine, that pay scheme would very often fall short.

Even though it would be legal, you would be hard pressed to find competent and reliable employees at that pay.

:lol: I bet I could! And I bet they would not be whining about it either. At 5-6 miles round trip average, they are getting $2.50 to $3.00 per delivery, plus tips, plus $2.13. Sounds like they would still make about $15-20 an hour.

You seem to think that being a delivery driver is some sort of specialized skill. It isn’t. I traded delivery for working in the store last night so an in store person could try delivery. I gave him my GPS and flashlight. We got slammed. He had NO problems, raked in over $15 an hour not counting his hourly wage, and had a blast. Lots more fun than earning minimum in the store.

You just think too highly about delivering. It ain’t rocket science and it is compensated VERY well.

You continue to confuse reimbursement for use of the drivers vehicle with wages. That’s OK. Many owners and managers have the same mindset. It is because that mindset continues to be perpetuated that I continue to post the facts here.

You just think to lowly about minimum wage laws and mileage reimbursement. For the record, being a manager or an owner is not ‘rocket science’ either. But if it makes you feel better, you can keep believing that it is:

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/blogs/thelede/posts/1122pizza1.jpg

:roll:

That seems to be a little unfair to imply that only managers and owners think reimbursement is counted as wages. Tons of drivers look at reimbursement as wages also. I was looking into getting a couple of used cars for my lil establishment so my drivers can use and wanna know what their 1st question was???

Question: Do we still get our reimbursement?
Answer: Nope
Reply: Well Ill just use my own car then.

Another example was when I did a 2 year stint w/ Corp Co. in Dirty Jersey. Our store had a company PT Cruiser fully logo’ed that we would use to do various marketing things with. Well at night when we weren’t using it for marketing the managers would ask if any of the drivers wanted to use it for deliveries. 9/10 times the answer was “NO”, why because they wouldn’t get a delivery reimbursement.

You drivers look at it as income just like we do so maybe you should put that one to rest.

Being an owner or a manager isnt rocket science but it sure as shat is a whole hell of alot easier then driving around all night smoking cigs and talking on your cell phone dropping off pizza 3-4 times an hour.

Now before you take my words out of context I dont think all drivers think that way but I would have to say that most (and its a huge most) do.

 

[Wizzle_Wassell]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
gregster:

At least I got you reading a discussion board where drivers are respected. It’s addictive, isn’t it?

Bottom line is I am spreading the word about minimum wage and mileage reimbursement laws, and you are a big help in that. Your incessant denial of what the law says so clearly only reinforces the stereotype of penny pinching owners doing and saying anything to keep from paying full minimum wage and mileage while crying poverty all the way to the bank.

This really should be a non issue, but to save even a penny it is denounced fiercely here. Your continued posts in denial only reinforce my point. Thanks again.

respected? If that is your honest evaluation of TTPG then I think you’ve made a very clear example of how out of touch you are. From what I can see posters on TTPG spend most of their time at each others throats theres very little ‘respect’ from what I’ve seen. As a site with a purpose ‘To let people see the truth about pizza delivery’ it sure paints a great picture doesn’t it! but a place where drivers are respected? nah not in a million years!

The only thing being denounced here is your opinion. YOU are in such a place that you can’t even see that the main person you are arguing with doesn’t even own a shop - so how does that ‘reinforces the stereotype of penny pinching owners doing and saying anything to keep from paying full minimum wage and mileage’?

Anything you post is 100% law, anything which contradicts it is our misinterpretation. You’ve no qualification in the interpretation of law, you WORK as a driver at one of the shops you so despise so what’s to take seriously?

 

[paul7979]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

The point is that the EMPLOYER must MAINTAIN them, even if the employee must fill them out. That’s why it is called "record KEEPING’ and not ‘record filling-outing’.

So Gregster, if your employer gave you a sheet of paper for you to fill out your actual costs and reimbursed you the actual expenses, you would be satisfied with that? What if these actual expenses only added up to 27 cents per mile?

 

[dman66]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
gregster:

Charles:

You are really getting flustered, gregster! You even changed your signature on TTPG to link to this thread. :lol:

And in your “siggy” thread you even quote on of TTPG rules:

g. Attacking the poster instead of the content of the post. Debate is fine but let’s not get ugly. This typically means you are defeated and have nothing real to say.
:lol:

You really have no life outside of this single issue, do you?

You accuse me of something when you too are an accomplice in the act? Do you often throw hand grenades straight up in the air and wait for them to fall? :?

At least I got you reading a discussion board where drivers are respected. It’s addictive, isn’t it?

Bottom line is I am spreading the word about minimum wage and mileage reimbursement laws, and you are a big help in that. Your incessant denial of what the law says so clearly only reinforces the stereotype of penny pinching owners doing and saying anything to keep from paying full minimum wage and mileage while crying poverty all the way to the bank.

This really should be a non issue, but to save even a penny it is denounced fiercely here. Your continued posts in denial only reinforce my point. Thanks again.

Cut the BS grego :roll: …You’re just an owner hater spreading spam here & relaying it back to TTPG…Once again your agrument is very selective & redundant…You cut & paste, underline only the selective sections of DOL guidelines that suit your own interpretations…Being you’re not a lawyer you have trouble understanding laws can have opposing interpretations & consequences…Your skills for debate are very poor, since you are unable to comprehend any contradicting argument…You only know what repetitively post…And you do it with ZERO charisma too…

Another great trait of yours is, when you get frustrated & flustered you resort to personal attacks & homosexxual fixations to relieve your stress… :lol:

Even if you drive an older, depreciated car with good gas economy, the guy is still owed .55 (nontaxable) a mile. :?: …Even though it may cost him .20 a mile to operate… :roll:

 

[Wizzle_Wassell]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver

paul7979:

The point is that the EMPLOYER must MAINTAIN them, even if the employee must fill them out. That’s why it is called "record KEEPING’ and not ‘record filling-outing’.

So Gregster, if your employer gave you a sheet of paper for you to fill out your actual costs and reimbursed you the actual expenses, you would be satisfied with that? What if these actual expenses only added up to 27 cents per mile?

I know if I asked my drivers to record the ‘actual’ costs I’d get away with much less than I pay presently. I pay ‘road legal’ (OBU) insurance so thats zero insurance cost. I know that nearly all do not have their vehicles serviced, most will have absolutely no idea how to work out depreciation and even if they did it would be minimal on most of their vehicles, and based on my absence records most breakdowns, flat tyres and other car problems happen outside of work. Maybe as a ‘penny pinching owner’ I should move to actual costs!

 

[dman66]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
Wizzle Wassell:

paul7979:

The point is that the EMPLOYER must MAINTAIN them, even if the employee must fill them out. That’s why it is called "record KEEPING’ and not ‘record filling-outing’.

So Gregster, if your employer gave you a sheet of paper for you to fill out your actual costs and reimbursed you the actual expenses, you would be satisfied with that? What if these actual expenses only added up to 27 cents per mile?

I know if I asked my drivers to record the ‘actual’ costs I’d get away with much less than I pay presently. I pay ‘road legal’ (OBU) insurance so thats zero insurance cost. I know that nearly all do not have their vehicles serviced, most will have absolutely no idea how to work out depreciation and even if they did it would be minimal on most of their vehicles, and based on my absence records most breakdowns, flat tyres and other car problems happen outside of work. Maybe as a ‘penny pinching owner’ I should move to actual costs!

No actual expenses, He just wants .55 a mile PERIOD…His lawyering himself says so, along with his redundancy have convinced him so…You can raise the delivery charge to 4 bucks, it doesn’t matter to him as long as he gets .55 a mile in mileage pay…Even if the delivery charge kills your delivery volume, kills his tips, & puts him out of a job, he doesn’t care…Its .55 a mile PERIOD…

 

[system]

Re: Lawsuit Against Domino’s for Failing to Reimburse Driver
Wizzle Wassell:

Anything you post is 100% law, anything which contradicts it is our misinterpretation. You’ve no qualification in the interpretation of law, you WORK as a driver at one of the shops you so despise so what’s to take seriously?

The very point you are attempting to make disqualifies your own opinion for the very same reason.