Want to start delivery. Need help.

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Rockstar pizza:
again the .55 is not something we pay you as a seperate wage. IT IS A DEDUCTION you can take on your tax return, its an allowance. Its considered a cost for you. ( like I take all that deduction since I supply all the vehicles.
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I’m not going to paste the links again, since they’re so readily available on any of Gregster’s threads, but we’re not talking about a deduction here. What the law says is that if I’m being payed minimum wage and my job requires me to use a personal vehicle, if I incur any operating costs (gas, maintenance, depreciation) in the course of my work, then my employer must reimburse me for those costs or he is violating minimum wage laws. Because the true cost of operating a vehicle is somewhat nebulous, the IRS gives people the option of using their standard rate to determine cost, currently $.55/mile. If it’s your car being used, you can claim a deduction on your taxes as an operating cost.
Rockstar pizza:
BUT JUST CURRIOUS by the logic of the .55 can I deduct that from your pay since they are my cars…where do I get my .55?
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Nope, you’re using the cars to benefit your business, you get your $.55/mile from the IRS in the form of a deduction. It’s like if I owned a factory, I don’t get to charge my employees for the use of the equipment, but I can deduct the cost of said equipment from my taxes. If the employees were bringing their own equipment into work, I would have to reimburse them the operating costs.
 
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Uncle Doug:
… Gregster’s theory is that tips aren’t counted in the minimum wage argument, …
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It’s not my theory. It’s the law:

From page 38 of the DOL Field Operations Handbook (FOH) chapter 30

http://www.dol.gov/esa/whd/FOH/FOH_Ch30.pdf

“Tips in excess of statutory tip credit may not be credited against uniform purchase and maintenance costs”
 
Tip Pooling was mentioned by some other posters. Here is some relevant info:

Servers and Bartenders Underpaid–Pooled Tips Partially to Blame

http://tacoma.injuryboard.com/miscellan … eid=252344
November 30, 2008 - 11:05 AM
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We are seeing more and more cases involving unpaid wages. Along those lines an interesting case out of Texas called Bernal v. Vankar Enterprises, Inc.

Mr. Bernal worked at a series of Texas bars. Tips from customers that were placed in a tip pool and distributed among all employees including managers. Mr. Bernal’s base hourly rate of pay was less than federal minimum wage, and did not receive time and a half pay for overtime.

Mr. Bernal instituted a class action. He alleged violations of the Fair Labor Standards Act (“FLSA”). The FLSA establishes a minimum hourly wage and overtime requirements.

However, some employers are permitted to pay employees less than the minimum wage if the employees receives tips that, when added to their hourly wage, amount to more than the statutory minimum. This practice, known as taking a “tip credit,†is only permitted if the employer has informed the employees of the tip credit provisions and if the employees retain all tips.

The Court held:
  1. The Bars violated their minimum wage obligations by failing to inform employees of the tip credit provisions, by requiring employees to cover cash register shortages and unpaid tabs, and by requiring employees to participate in tip pools which distributed tips to managers and janitors.
  2. The Bars violated the FLSA by failing to pay appropriate overtime wages.
The economy’s tough. You work hard. If you are not getting paid what you deserve, you should contact an attorney to review both your situation and your employer’s practices.

Here is what the DOL says about tip pooling:

http://www.dol.gov/esa/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs15.pdf
Tip Pooling: The requirement that an employee must retain all tips does not preclude a valid tip pooling or sharing arrangement among employees who customarily and regularly receive tips, such as waiters, waitresses, bellhops, counter personnel (who serve customers), busboys/girls and service bartenders. Tipped employees may not be required to share their tips with employees who have not customarily and regularly participated in tip pooling arrangements, such as dishwashers, cooks, chefs, and janitors. Only those tips that are in excess of tips used for the tip credit may be taken for a pool. Tipped employees cannot be required to contribute a greater percentage of their tips than is customary and reasonable.
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Learn more about minimum wage laws here:

http://www.dol.gov/esa/whd/flsa/
 
Unless the FLSA federal minimum wage laws don’t apply to you. Are you aware of other exceptions? I’d love to hear them. Would you please elaborate?
 
I’ve already elaborated on this in the following thread.

http://www.pmq.com/tt/viewtopic.php?top … 079&t=6547

It may not be exactly what this conversation is about but it does directly contradict your quoted statement of
Tips in excess of statutory tip credit may not be credited against uniform purchase and maintenance costs
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and it comes from the same maual that you are quoting from, just one page past where you are quoting from.
 
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I’m just refuting gregsters claims with the material he provided. I personally am not interested in this discussion other than argueing with gregster.
 
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The thing about it, they probably could actually pay gregster 2.13 an hour under the tip credit law in his state., instead of his 4 an hour …

http://www.ramw.org/index2.php?option=c … f=1&id=125

But through these rises, the federal tip credit rate
(also applicable in Virginia) will remain the same, $2.13 per hour.

I would think since his car is somewhat an older model car a good portion of that .55 a mile reimbursement is void in it’s self because of depreciation…The 1.08 he gets per run in mileage reimbursement probably is sufficient to cover the actual expenses of his car…If I were gregster I’d be thankful I’m getting 4 an hour instead of the 2.13 an hour…I wouldn’t be surprised in this bad economy they COULD find people to do the exact same job he does for 2.13 an hour…
 
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paul7979:
I’ve already elaborated on this in the following thread.

http://www.pmq.com/tt/viewtopic.php?top … 079&t=6547

It may not be exactly what this conversation is about but it does directly contradict your quoted statement of
Tips in excess of statutory tip credit may not be credited against uniform purchase and maintenance costs
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and it comes from the same maual that you are quoting from, just one page past where you are quoting from.
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And I already rebutted your post:

http://www.pmq.com/tt/viewtopic.php?top … ds&p=42097
 
Wizzle Wassell:
has anyone noticed that we are refering to a field handbook that is nearly 10 years old??
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Did the FLSAexpire and no one told me? :shock:

Have you also noticed that I have several times referenced the very latest official version of the CFR?

Can you cite a newer law or handbook that contradicts those I have linked to? I’d love to hear about it.
 
Oh well, I guess the specific example used on page 39 describing a situation where tips CAN be used for maintanence just doesn’t mean a thing when it doesn’t support your arguement.
 
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Charles, I agree with you. Sharing tips is not viable and promotes tensions between the staff. Driver understand the challenge of making a delivery in the shortest time possible and all the risks associated with navigating traffic. Pay the driver a slightly lower hourly rate than your inside store staff and allow those drivers to keep all tips.
 
I’ll agree to share my tips when those I share them with agree to share an equal percentage in paying my vehicle expenses. 😃
 
gregster:
I’ll agree to share my tips when those I share them with agree to share an equal percentage in paying my vehicle expenses. 😃
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I thought you said that tips aren’t applied to vehicle expenses. So if you were reimbursed at the IRS rate, you would share your tips?
 
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Will you also share the 55 cents per mile reimbursement that you demand if the others share in the 25 cents per mile expense that your vehicle costs?
 
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Charles:
gregster:
I’ll agree to share my tips when those I share them with agree to share an equal percentage in paying my vehicle expenses. 😃
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I thought you said that tips aren’t applied to vehicle expenses. So if you were reimbursed at the IRS rate, you would share your tips?
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Tips ARE applied to drivers being able to afford a vehicle in the first place. Drivers make the initial investment in the vehicle and are (under)paid back for the use of it.

Yes, the law does say that. But if I am ever told I must share my tips with insiders, I will insist that they share in the risks I take in bringing thousands of dollars of equipment to work everyday. (In other words. it won’t happen in my case.)
 
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paul7979:
Will you also share the 55 cents per mile reimbursement that you demand if the others share in the 25 cents per mile expense that your vehicle costs?
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The money I am paid for reimbursement of vehicle expenses is pay pack for money I already spent in bringing my vehicle to work to support someone else’s business. I do not voluntarily give my money to people who do not deserve it.

If business owners want drivers to subsidize their business with donated vehicle services, I suggest they recognize them as business partners and share part of the profits with them. Until then, I suggest they stick with a straight wage and fully pay for the vehicles they are ‘renting’ from the drivers.

Stop trying to have it both ways.
 
gregster:
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Charles:
gregster:
I’ll agree to share my tips when those I share them with agree to share an equal percentage in paying my vehicle expenses. 😃
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I thought you said that tips aren’t applied to vehicle expenses. So if you were reimbursed at the IRS rate, you would share your tips?
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Tips ARE applied to drivers being able to afford a vehicle in the first place. Drivers make the initial investment in the vehicle and are (under)paid back for the use of it.

Yes, the law does say that. But if I am ever told I must share my tips with insiders, I will insist that they share in the risks I take in bringing thousands of dollars of equipment to work everyday. (In other words. it won’t happen in my case.)
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You don’t understand. The federal rate takes into account ALL costs of the vehicle, including depreciation. So if you are fully compensated for the vehicle and the inside people are just as much a part of the customer’s experience, why not share the tips?

I think this really illustrates the true thoughts of drivers. They just want all the money they can get and only quote the law to do it. You are not waitpeople. You don’t take the orders. You do not provide continuing service like checking repeatedly to see what they need. You do not get paid $2.13 like they do. You simply pick up and order and deliver it. To use the law one way to increase your earnings, but on the other hand don’t care about the other employees who take the order (and hopefully increase the ticket amount) or make sure the pizzas are made correctly and quickly, shows the true selfish nature of the old-school pizza delivery dude. No teamwork. Just looking out for themselves.
 
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