Driver Compensation

[alfy]

I pay $7.25 hour, they get the full $2 delivery fee. Their tip average is almost $5 a delivery, including the $2 fee takes it to almost $7. I have one full-time driver (40 hours) who averages 90-100 deliveries a week, so he makes about $900 before taxes. He’s been with me for about 6 years. The full-time driver helps me with office paperwork in slow times and usually handles catering deliveries. All Drivers maintain their own car, need to have their own cell phone, make boxes, help answer phones, sweep, and mop unless they are out on late runs. I have 3 other part-time drivers and I’m looking to hire another right now.

We deliver pizza and our full Italian menu (pasta, seafood, chicken, veal, wings) and its funny how delivery tips almost never are based on a percentage of the bill, they always average around $5 no matter what the bill, unlike our servers who usually average 20% tip. Our Delivery / Pick-Up / Dine-In split is roughly 30%/20%/50%.

The full-time guy used to work at Pizza Hut part-time as well, they paid him $7.25, but only a portion of the delivery charge. Then if he took 2 deliveries in 1 run, they only pay for the first delivery and then like $.25 for the second, and if they take more than 2 deliveries at once they get nothing after the second (I guess it’s their policy to never take more than 2 but it happened quite often.) He trained their for management but the pay was too low and when a driver quit last year he started for me full-time.

 

[Piper]

alfy:

I pay $7.25 hour, they get the full $2 delivery fee. Their tip average is almost $5 a delivery, including the $2 fee takes it to almost $7. I have one full-time driver (40 hours) who averages 90-100 deliveries a week, so he makes about $900 before taxes.

This is one area where I have to agree with drivers’ gripes. The “delivery fee” that you are paying your drivers is NOT compensation. They will rake us over the coals for claiming that it is - and they’re correct. That $2.00 needs to be considered reimbursement for their expenses of fuel and vehicle maintenance.

 

[pizzatime]

Gregster - I have read your posts and to be honest find you annoying. Thank God they (tt) has a different thread just for your angst against capitalism.

I bet you think health care is going to be free.

Have you ever invested your lifes savings, mortgaged your house to the hill,worked 24/7 with no pay…have you ever owned a business? I know you havent just by reading your posts.

Is your name Ray? I think it is. The Ray that worked at one of my shops and now you work at PJ? You sound just like him.

I’ve been in this business for over 20 years and have owned more shops than cars you have driven. I have seen hundreds of drivers and you represent the smallest percentaged but the largest headache.

Pizza delivery is for those that need extra cash, people in there 20’s that enjoy partying before they start up their life, people that have a full time job but need that extra boost for the family, people that deliver while looking for a career, and those that smoke pot and have no ambition to better themselves and those that have no other skills in life—I’ve seen it all!

I bet you believe in spreading the wealth around attitude. Those mean business owners with all that money - give me, give me, I made your business, I deliver.

I need to go, taxes are due the 15th(you know about this) also I need to address a issue at work making this day a 15 hour day.

so long

 

[pizzatime]

Piper:

alfy:

I pay $7.25 hour, they get the full $2 delivery fee. Their tip average is almost $5 a delivery, including the $2 fee takes it to almost $7. I have one full-time driver (40 hours) who averages 90-100 deliveries a week, so he makes about $900 before taxes.

This is one area where I have to agree with drivers’ gripes. The “delivery fee” that you are paying your drivers is NOT compensation. They will rake us over the coals for claiming that it is - and they’re correct. That $2.00 needs to be considered reimbursement for their expenses of fuel and vehicle maintenance.

A driver can claim miledge or fuel not both. The delivery charge is part of their income. Miledge credit will lower tax liabilty tremendously

pt

 

[system]

pizzatime:

A driver can claim miledge or fuel not both. The delivery charge is part of their income. Miledge credit will lower tax liabilty tremendously

pt

Wrong. Mileage reiumbursement, if paid properly, should cover all vehicle expenses including gas.

The delivery charge is not, never has, and never will be part of a driver’s income. The delivery charge is a convenience fee collected by the store to offset the “burden of cost” by offering delivery. If the store chooses to pay any or all of the collected delivery charge to the driver as mileage compensation, that is up to the store. But never fool yourself into believing that the delivery charge is part of a driver’s income. Income = hourly wages and tips collected after vehicle expenses.

 

[pizzatime]

PPG2270:

pizzatime:

A driver can claim miledge or fuel not both. The delivery charge is part of their income. Miledge credit will lower tax liabilty tremendously

pt

Wrong. Mileage reiumbursement, if paid properly, should cover all vehicle expenses including gas.

The delivery charge is not, never has, and never will be part of a driver’s income. The delivery charge is a convenience fee collected by the store to offset the “burden of cost” by offering delivery. If the store chooses to pay any or all of the collected delivery charge to the driver as mileage compensation, that is up to the store. But never fool yourself into believing that the delivery charge is part of a driver’s income. Income = hourly wages and tips collected after vehicle expenses.

I can slice the delivery charge any way I like. If I choose to keep it all, I can. If I choose to pay you $10/hr and and have the store keep the delivery charge I can.

You can NOT claim miledge and fuel cost as a driver. It’s one or the other. Miledge reimbursement is better most of the times.

pt

 

[NicksPizza]

PPG2270:

pizzatime:

A driver can claim miledge or fuel not both. The delivery charge is part of their income. Miledge credit will lower tax liabilty tremendously

pt

Wrong. Mileage reiumbursement, if paid properly, should cover all vehicle expenses including gas.

The delivery charge is not, never has, and never will be part of a driver’s income. The delivery charge is a convenience fee collected by the store to offset the “burden of cost” by offering delivery. If the store chooses to pay any or all of the collected delivery charge to the driver as mileage compensation, that is up to the store. But never fool yourself into believing that the delivery charge is part of a driver’s income. Income = hourly wages and tips collected after vehicle expenses.

What am I missing? delivery charge is paid to the shop as a convenience fee. Fine. If I pay some of that fee to an employee, then it becomes income . . . the driver gets to decide what they intend to do with it. Now, NET income will always include expenses for vehicle maintenance, but if I paid it out to you, then it is income. You can choose to spend it on car maintenance and fuel . . . that is up to the driver.

 

[system]

after a very expensive disagreement with the IRS i don’t pay my driver at all. he is an independent contractor. he adds $2 to each delivery and collects it above the price on the box plus tips. i never touch the money he gets. he does nothing around the shop, he doesn’t even need to be there, just be available when i’m open and he has a cell phone. he uses his own car and i let him use my delivery bags. he buys the pizza from me with a 20 dollar bill and i give him change for a 20 with small orders, then he goes home or wherever he wants unless i give him a call for another delivery. i can fold my own boxes, it’s a small shop. j

 

[system]

NicksPizza:

What am I missing? delivery charge is paid to the shop as a convenience fee. Fine. If I pay some of that fee to an employee, then it becomes income . . . the driver gets to decide what they intend to do with it. Now, NET income will always include expenses for vehicle maintenance, but if I paid it out to you, then it is income. You can choose to spend it on car maintenance and fuel . . . that is up to the driver.

Hi Nick,

Mileage is a reiumbursement for vechicle expenses and is not taxable, therefore not considered income.

Whatever money the shop uses (including delivery charges) to pay mileage is therefore not income.

That is what you are missing.

 

[system]

PPG2270:

NicksPizza:

What am I missing? delivery charge is paid to the shop as a convenience fee. Fine. If I pay some of that fee to an employee, then it becomes income . . . the driver gets to decide what they intend to do with it. Now, NET income will always include expenses for vehicle maintenance, but if I paid it out to you, then it is income. You can choose to spend it on car maintenance and fuel . . . that is up to the driver.

Hi Nick,

Mileage is a reiumbursement for vechicle expenses and is not taxable, therefore not considered income.

Whatever money the shop uses (including delivery charges) to pay mileage is therefore not income.

That is what you are missing.

What is “reiumbursement” ???

 

[system]

qcfmike:

What is “reiumbursement” ???

Ok, spelling error. I scratched my cornea over the holiday so give me a break ok? :shock:

When spelled correctly, the word implies money paid back that has already been spent. That is, the store pays the driver mileage for car expenditures, i.e. money that has already been used. This is not income, but rather pay back for the money used on the necessary tool of the job (the car).

Put another way, you wouldn’ t ask a cook to bring in his own oven to bake the pizza without paying for the use of that oven. If you did, the money given to the cook for use of the oven would not be income, now would it? Perhaps an “oven fee” could be added to the total to cover the cost of payment for the oven. :roll:

 

[system]

Ok that being said, 0h, and sorry to hear about the eye, but then why don’t all of the drivers take advantage of deducting actual expenses on their income taxes and get the money tax free anyway? I doubt delivery drivers will get the $0.51 per mile that the 2011 IRS rate allows. Now, don’t get me wrong, I fully agree that drivers be paid for their whole expense of using their own vehicles, but then we open up the next can of worms. Is delivering a pizza worth $20 an hour? Well, no. So if they make minimum wage and the pizza shop collects the entire delivery fee and also the tips…then reimburses the mileage rate to the driver…is that fair? Maybe…maybe not. So what is the happy median here. Honestly, having been a delivery guy for a time myself, I will take the tips and delivery charge everyday of the week over mileage. Even at minimum wage… the extra 2-4 deliveries an hour should add up nicely. Now before all the drivers ring in here… yes the job has its risks but so do most…so please… I don’t want to hear it again. Now back to the money… you cannot have it both ways. Until the general public opens their eyes again and realizes that pizza can be great and not just mass produced crap…they won’t pay $5 a delivery and then tip and pay $20 per pizza…as they should for decent pizza. The big guys have run this business into the ground for most indies and most places that offer great pizza for a reasonable price. Yes there are the nitch places that succeed but there are 100 that do not for every one that does. Bottom line is that if a driver can average $15-20 an hour and out of that they have to cover their vehicle expenses…they are still doing pretty well for what the general job requires. The fact of the matter is still that being a delivery person for 99% of people is a stepping stone and not a career choice. I get a little bit of a laugh at how much drivers can make at this job. You work independently, have little oversight, get to drive around, talk on the phone, listen to what you want to listen too, etc…etc. Do you know how many people drive an 30-60 minutes to work each way, pay for all their own expenses, make less than $10 an hour, and then do it again tomorrow? The sad thing is that this describes the majority of the US workforce these days. Look at some of the benefits that you have and be grateful you have a job at all…it’s not that bad when compared to a whole lot of other options that you could be doing. :idea:

 

[system]

Odd, but I agree with most of what you said. I am no longer in the pizza business, but was involved for years in all capacities, from driver of an indy to GM at Domino’s (store 4434 -out of busines -not my fault). As you know however, I am a driver “for life” and sympathize with the pathetic turn the delivery industry has taken.

Two issues: It is true that most jobs do not have mileage reimbursment, but then again, how many of those use their cars for the job? Most people drive to work and park the car until the shift is over. I work in mental health now, and I do travel, and I get reimbursed for it. However, there are no frequent stops and starts (that’s enough, we all know about wear and tear on a pizza car). Whether a store pays mileage out of poclet or uses the delivery charge to pay it, the driver should receive the full compensation owed to them. However, I realize that it will be a cold day you know where before that happens.

Second point: The large chains have made it miserable for everyone. They are selling pies at 1980’s prices, and this takes a toll on indies and drivers. The masses want the pizza cheap, and companies like Domino’s and Papa Johns are willing to accomodate that. In doing so, they send their slop out at “$10”, but is it really $10? No, because they slap a delivery charge on to the total, thereby not only disguising the true cost,but throwing the driver under the bus at the same time. The driver MAY get a smaller tip because of the delivery charge, and those that tip by percent are tipping based on a “$10” pizza. Furthermore, the true pizzarias (ones that pay the driver their true worth) are stuck with less volume because they are putting out a quality pie at higher prices. To combat this, they are forced to go to tip credit on the driver as well, and the whole thing just goes downhill from there. Even if you advertise quality over price, the “bottom-liners” are still going to pick $10 slop.

So, what is a driver supposed to do? Work for a Big 3 and get paid tip credit wages, or go to an indy paying more, but with less volume (and therefore less tips)?

 

[Matt2011]

From a full time drivers perspective:

I delivered pizza for almost 3 years on Long Island (suburban NYC) for two separate independent pizzerias, and I definitely say that it is an extremely lucrative & well paying job. I was being paid $9.50 an hour plus tips, and $1 per delivery - many weeks I would clear about $1000-$1100 (before paying for gas and mechanical work) working 5.5 days (65 hours). Here are a few points to consider:

• The area I worked was relatively well off where the median household income was $100k+. The average tip over the course of the day was around $5, and that is not including the $1 per delivery that I received. Being situated near an industrial park, lunchtime deliveries could sometimes yield average tips of $8+.
• The average delivery round trip was about 2.5 miles. There was not need to deliver too far as there were 11 other independent pizzerias serving within a 5 mile radius. Needless to say competition was quite fierce.
• I was being paid $9.5/hour due to the fact that I would cross as a counter person. When we weren’t busy I was the utility guy so to speak. Average driver compensation in the area was around $7/hour plus w/e delivery charge and tips were made.
• While not being familiar with the “Big 3’s” policies and compensation rates, I can say with 100% certainty that less than 1% of independent pizzerias anywhere near where I worked did not reimburse their drivers for mechanical repairs, and rightfully so. Mechanical repairs need to be done to vehicles regardless of whether or not you are delivering pizza. Sure, it exacerbates the mechanical wear on your vehicle, that should be looked at as a business expense. Oil changes and all, I would spend on average of $250 a month maintaining my used vehicles. I drove at different points a 1995 Honda Civic EX, a 1995 Nissan Maxima SE, and a 1998 C280 Mercedes-Benz. At no point did I ever feel that I was spending too much in repairs that I felt I was undercompensated.
• Many pizzeria charge $2 and up for delivery and do not give their drivers anything.
• On average I would do about 25 deliveries per day.
• My job duties (just as a driver) would be to stock and level the soda machine & make boxes - both very easy and would never take more than an hours time.

So let’s break this down from a monetary perspective and compare it to any other profession:
5.5 shifts * 25 deliveries = 137 Deliveries
137 Deliveries @ $4/tip (average) + $1 per delivery = $685
65 Hours * $9.50/hour = $618
Total weekly income = $1300 average - taxes (I wasn’t claiming everything - taxes would generally amount to $200-$300/week) = $1050/average

Now let’s factor in gas prices
137 Deliveries * 2.5 miles per delivery = 342 miles
342 miles / 20mpg (my cars average) = 17 gallons of gas
17 gallons of gas * $4.50 (peak price of gas) = $63/week

Now mechanical work
$250/month / 4.33 weeks in a month = $60/week

So now that’s $1050 - $123 =$927
$927/65 = $15/hour

Where else can a college kid make $15/hour clean, and have a great job like delivering pizza?! People don’t take this into account. Many drivers are high school/college kids who are looking for some extra cash. I took my job very seriously and ran it like a business. Delivering pizza is a cake job; smoking cigarettes (food was always in trunk…), listening to music, and driving around…that sounds like a pretty good job! I think anyone who suggests that owners pay for drivers gas and mechanical expenses are over the top. Commercial liability insurance is very expensive, and this is part of the reason pizzerias charge delivery fees - to offset this expense. If any driver would complain about these points, I would simply suggest they get a job working in a supermarket for $8/hour and don’t complain.

Bottom line:

I think appropriate driver compensation (for anywhere in the USA for that matter) for any independent pizzeria should be around $7-8/hour with some type of per delivery compensation ($.50 - $2.00 - depending on gas rates). This is more than enough. Mechanical and gas expense should NOT be paid by the pizzeria. Delivering pizza is not a skilled job as to require a higher hourly wage.

Perhaps for chain pizzerias, the drivers should receive some additional per delivery compensation only because people who order that type of food tend to be cheap, and hence bad tips.

I hope this helps.

 

[wa_dave]

Nice to see a level headed and considered comments from a driver unlike the previous dribble that we hear from “Gregster”
Well articulated and taking an all round view

Dave

 

[system]

Matt2011:

From a full time drivers perspective:

I am certain that any store would be delighted to have you as a driver, but let’s examine a few of your “arguments” shall we:

1. Regarding commercial insurace: You are right, the stores that carry commercial insurance pay out the wazoo for it. But you get into an accident, mister, and see who is paying for the repairs.
2. Regarding mileage/delivery fees: Stores (even those with commercial insurance) got by plenty easily during the “free delivery” era. The trend to have a delivery charge while gas prices are booming (again) does not sit well with many drivers, especially when said charge may lower the overall tip.
3. Regarding the “overall maintenance” of a vehicle: While not every store does it, some pay straight sub-minimum wage and others (such as Papa John’s) use a split-pay scheme. This, by definition, proves that your car is just as much an employee as you are. Don’t believe me? Try to not wear a car topper (again, where applicable) and see what happens? Furthermore, some places (such as Domino’s) have regular car inspections, where if you have so much as a book in your backseat, you fail. One other thing. If you cannot come to work because you blew a gasket or have bald tires, well, try it and see what happens. “Sorry boss, I couldn’t fix my engine, I had to pay the electric bill instead.” Compensation (wages and tips) should be clear for the employee to use to pay for everyday life (as is the case with every other profession) and should not be used for car maintenance. Do the cooks have to pay for oven repairs?
4. Regarding “who” does the job: This could be a great job for college kids who have no other expenses but to worry about who is furnishing the beer for the next party. However, many veterans who have chosen to do this as a career have seen the conditions (specifically financial compensation) slide so far down that it hardly pays the bills and therefore is hardly worth doing it anymore. People who made upwards of $9-10 per hour as a base have seen the wages drop to sweatshop levels.

Get on board with the way things are, college boy. The owners will love to own you as well.

 

[system]

Matt I agree with Dave… it is nice to see a post from a driver like yourself. The other comment I would like to make is even in your situation…spending $250 a month on repairs… why not just buy a $15k 40mpg rice burner? A new one. Full warranty. Might even get free oil changes out of it. Or lease one for $139.00 a month right now. You might go over on mileage…but buy it at lease end and sell it…remove the penalty. Oh, and no matter what people say…some here will never see it any different than they do. I delivered pizza…paid my own gas and repairs… and in the rural area I ran… a 20 mile round trip was 1 out of 4 runs. We had a big lake to get around and it was either South or West to do it. The other problem is that they did not connect on the backside. Big state park and a dam. So you could run 20+ on one side to get back and have to run 15+ the other side. Gas was $1.25 and I got $1 for the run plus tips were $1-3 usually. Base pay was minimum… $3.65 if I remember right. I did get 30 mpg…but when you factor in distance…it could be close to break even if you did not have multiple pies to take. It really sucked walking out the door as the phone ringed for a delivery to the house 3 doors down from where you were heading. Again… GOOD POST! :!:

 

[system]

I have another thing too say…after hearing over and over from some that constantly complain about the repairs and upkeep to their cars. What part of needing a reliable vehicle to work in a delivery based position did you not understand when taking said job? Get a job as the Walmart greeter for $8 an hour then…or Subway for the same pay. They are all entry level positions much as a pizza delivery driver is… not many make a career out of this. You will not likely get rich off pizza delivery unless you get a scratch ticket that wins as a tip one night. If your car is a POS then maybe driving for a living is not a great move? Just a thought! Also… Matt’s comment about averaging $15 an hour is NOT BAD for any person these days in a non-technical/professional position. Then again…what is that commercial on tv where you can get your associates degree in accouting, business mgmt, pizza delivery, etc… tv/vcr repair… Hmm… what’s a VCR? :shock:

 

[system]

Another one of my posts with legitimate questions gets deleted.

So what’s the problem this time Daddio? Don’t want to hear the truth, can’t handle the truth, or just don’t want to hear it from a “lowly” driver?

Sorry, but in no way, shape, or form when a drivers makes more money than most shifties is it an “entry-level position.”

Drivers should have to cook/manage before being allowed to drive. That way, the actual “promotion” takes place.

I have copied this to my computer and will keep posting it until you explain why you randomly delete my posts with legitimate questions that move the conversation forward or until another moderator explains to me how I am “breaking the rules.”

 

[Daddio]

PPG2270:

Another one of my posts with legitimate questions gets deleted.

So what’s the problem this time Daddio? Don’t want to hear the truth, can’t handle the truth, or just don’t want to hear it from a “lowly” driver?

Sorry, but in no way, shape, or form when a drivers makes more money than most shifties is it an “entry-level position.”

Drivers should have to cook/manage before being allowed to drive. That way, the actual “promotion” takes place.

I have copied this to my computer and will keep posting it until you explain why you randomly delete my posts with legitimate questions that move the conversation forward or until another moderator explains to me how I am “breaking the rules.”

Along with you ridiculous rants you make ridiculous assumptions. Since you are not even in the industry I neither care whether you post or what your posts contain. To me you are irrelevant. Just don’t make accusations that you can’t substantiate.